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Issa Rae and Syreeta Singleton take on hip-hop

Issa Rae and Syreeta Singleton discuss the rap game in Rap Sh!t
Rap Sh!t created by Issa Rae and Syreeta Singleton premieres on Crave
Courtesy of Bell Media

RAP SH!T created by Issa Rae and Syreeta Singleton with Aida Osman and KaMillion. Streaming on Crave beginning July 21.


I’m talking to Rap Sh!t creators Issa Rae and Syreeta Singleton about WAP, the inexhaustible rap tune from Megan Thee Stallion and Cardi B about the slurpy sounds that come from a woman’s treasure trove. I brought up the song not for its content but because it seemed a rare celebratory moment when two female rap stars at the top of their game jumped on a track together. The dynamic felt different from years of tension between Lil’ Kim and Foxy Brown or even Cardi B and Nicki Minaj.

Rae previously collaborated with Singleton on Insecure, the groundbreaking series about the daily grind, which she created and starred in. Their new series is about two female rappers collaborating while dealing with all the challenges women in the industry put up with. Rae sees WAP as part of a tradition. The phenomenon surrounding the catchy track is just the latest example of women owning their sexuality and subsequently being torn down by people latching on to conservative talking points.

“Lil’ Kim went through it, Britney Spears went through it, Janet Jackson went through it,” Rae points out in a Zoom interview with NOW. “What I find interesting is when women also tend to tack on to that attack: ‘Yeah, why are we talking about our pussies? What is this?’”

“Your pussy probably needs to be spoken about,” Singleton adds. Singleton, who worked with Rae on Insecure, then refers to a great analysis she read about how WAP is about healthy vaginas, before wondering whether she had gone too deep. “Where are we going with that?” she asks, laughing.

Rae and Singleton – along with stars KaMillion and Aida Osman in a separate interview – spoke to NOW about this moment in rap, where women have been dominating the game while being both celebrated and scrutinized for their sexuality, and how they channelled that into Rap Sh!t. Watch the conversations in the videos below or read the edited and condensed version further down.

NOW: There’s something in the air. There’s a lot of women in rap content going on. We just had (the TV show) Queens come out. The Toronto International Film Festival announced the world premiere of Sanaa Lathan’s On The Come Up, adapted from Angie Thomas’ novel. What is in the ether that we’re getting this content now?

Issa Rae: Female rappers have always been here. They have just not gotten the same spotlight. And it does feel like something is in the air where female rappers are able to take control of their own narratives, whether it’s via coming up through social media, whether it’s audiences clamouring for them. There’s just a different demand for the female voice in that genre. It’s been so male dominated for a while. And I think as fans and as creatives, it’s just really enticing and appealing to be able to go into that world and tell that story because we’re all aware. Even in Angie’s book, On The Come Up, it is about that come-up story and it’s just about how hard it is to break in as a female rapper in this male-dominated industry. That was really an exciting story to tell just because I see so much of that criticism constantly. They’re just put under a different kind of microscope and scrutiny.

Syreeta Singleton: I think it’s also reflective of the culture too. They’re kind of going hand-in-hand. Just as female rap is really empowering women right now, women are also just becoming more empowered and more comfortable expressing ourselves. And you’re seeing it reflected in the art. It all feels timely. I think we’re all collectively going through this transition and evolution. And then we’re seeing it in the music.

NOW: I remember Angie Thomas saying as a woman in rap, you’ve loved it for so long, but it never loved you back. I think we know what she’s talking about when she says that.

KaMillion: Hip-hop didn’t love me back until I really found my own lane, embraced myself and started to just accept my own shit; not look for acceptance and not look for my representation in other people. I became the representation. That’s life. I think that’s what makes social media cool these days. The girls that are really poppin’ these days really are the spearheads of their own lane.

Aida Osman: I’m a child of the internet. I got to find the exact women I wanted to find. I didn’t have to deal with the nonsense. I saw when people were critiquing Nicki, Lil’ Kim and Trina from when I was really young. But I also came up in the generation where my first favourite rappers were Rico Nasty, Bali Baby, Hook, Bktherula, all these women now that are coming up that are so specifically themselves. I feel like the internet gave me so much access to these women that I didn’t even have to see all the nonsense, you know what I mean? She has such a different experience because she’s working in that industry. As a fan and as a listener, it’s so easy for me to find the women I actually connect with.

IR: Everyone knows, this is literally a male-dominated industry. We get to have those conversations in this show. Even if you’re a talented female rapper, you are still subjected to this male gaze and even discredited often. “Oh, they had to have help from this particular artist.” Or, “the only reason they made it is because they’re tied to this person.” The conversations about what you have to do and what you have to sacrifice to be seen and to be taken seriously are really interesting.

NOW: Is there a parallel to that as a woman in television?

SS: There are parallels everywhere. I think we’re just talking about what it means to be a woman in almost any industry. What it means to be a woman in America, and at this current time. I don’t even want to go into whole feminism rant. That’s been something that has obviously had different waves. But it’s something that’s been more popularized, especially now with the current climate. Women are using their voices more to say this is our bodies, this is what we will do or won’t do with our bodies and we should have the right. All of these things are parallel, when it comes to the art that we make, how we choose to express ourselves, what we choose to wear and our right to choose. They’re all relevant in so many different ways. So it makes sense that it will show up in our music too.

IR: Just piggyback off of that. Even in putting out the teaser for this, I’ve seen responses from men like, “of all the stories that you can tell about women, these are the stories that you’re going to tell.” Without seeing the show. Even policing the type of stories that we can tell as women, which is literally what we talk about in the show as well, is just interesting to me. Men don’t get it.

NOW: I read the Rolling Stone story where you explained the origin of this show was Jermaine Dupri’s comments about [women rappers today] all sounding the same. He’s saying out loud what a lot of people are thinking, or also saying out loud. That attitude is interesting to me because you’re looking at Cardi and Meg and all you’re [judging] is the packaging. You should know the club hit does not speak to the album. I feel like they don’t give the women the benefit of the doubt to listen to the whole thing. They only see what’s on the surface.

IR: Yeah, because what incentive do they have to go deeper. I think as women, we’re socially conditioned to think about men and their needs. And even in the content that we consume. Even the way that we’re desired sexually, it’s always in service of men. Men don’t have that same incentive for us; to treat us equally, to consider our feelings; to have empathy for us. That doesn’t surprise me. I don’t even know what has to change. Men have to advocate on behalf of women. Men have to have those conversations with men. Men just don’t listen to women.

SS: It’s this idea of approval. Needing approval or acceptance from men is something that is just baked into our society. Not to give the men a full pass, but it’s baked into our society and it’s something that we are just actively unlearning.

IR: And there has to be a willingness to unlearn.

NOW: There’s a line in your show about the “bad bitch [renaissance].” It made me think about how these male rappers in this industry have always wanted women to be in the background, whether they’re in the club, the strippers or whatnot. They always want them to have that ornamental role. And now this [renaissance] is giving those women voice. The ones that were in the background of the video all of a sudden have a voice. Do you feel like there’s a push-back to that because [men are] losing some of their dominance?

IR: I’m sure that that’s part of it. A lot of the music empowering women may, in men’s eyes, discredit them. Sometimes a woman rising – men may feel – reduces them. I think that’s part of the problem. It’s just like, “nobody’s even talking about you.” Just because a woman bigs herself up does not mean that you’re any lesser. But there’s something that you find threatening about that and I think you have to ask yourself why. And to be honest, some of the braggadocious music does say, “Oh, I don’t need a man for this.” And so men might view that and be like, well, “let’s go toe-to-toe, then. Let me come back and tell you why you’re not shit.”

SS: And they’ve been saying that. They’re just used to being in control. It’s just different. Things are changing. Change is scary. We know. It’s all scary. We don’t know what it’s going to look like. But get on board.

RS: What do y’all think of the new Drake album?

IR: I love it.

SS: I actually really love it too. It’s not full house music.

IR: It was just a welcome change. I saw the criticism before I got to listen to the album. I’m glad I did because I went into it like, “Oh shit, are people not fucking with this?” And then listening to it, I love it. It’s different for him. I’ve been jamming it.

SS: I thought it was a nice blend, too. The way he moves in and out of different sounds, it feels like a  whole piece that was curated and put together. And then you still get Drake. The Drake that you’re looking for, he’s still there. It’s just like the sound, the sonics are shifting.

@justsayrad

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